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PostPosted: Wed Jan 04, 2017 5:23 pm 
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I have a new iMac (OS X 10.12.2) which I would like to sync my iPad ( 3rd Gen)to. Currently I use a MacBook 2,1. OS X 10.6.8) to sync to my iPad. I have read up a little on Home Sharing and I understand this method is preferred because of its ease. I also read (from the same document) that using an external Drive is also good because you are making a back up of your iTunes Library and Play lists.

I would like to now if anyone has a preference and know how long this process will take? ( I presently have over 2.5 GB of mp3 files)


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 04, 2017 7:02 pm 
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To my knowledge the only way to sync an iOS device to a new system is to use the migration wizard to migrate everything from the computer you previously had synced the iOS device to.

Otherwise you would be forced to set it up as a new iOS device on the new system because zomg the RIAA/MPAA insists you're going to pirate music and movies if Apple doesn't force you to wipe the device.

Of course you could just copy the music over and add it to iTunes on the new system then go through the motions of setting up the iOS device again. If you have a lot of playlists though (and want to maintain them) you would need to copy the music & iTunes library, then put the music at the same path as it was on the old system.

Like, I have all my music and movies on an external drive. If I copied my iTunes library off to that drive, then hooked it up to a new computer, I could then open the library in iTunes because the music & movies would all be right where the library says they're at. When you move them to a new spot you have to tediously tell iTunes where the files are located and it's not particularly bright about it... if you have /path/to/mp3/artist/album/track.mp3 it will find everything in /album/ but won't go further up and search through /path/to/mp3/ for other items in your library.


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 04, 2017 8:19 pm 
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MonkeyBoy,

Thanks for responding to my issue.

It will be just music (no movies), some from purchased CDs, some from websites via the artist themselves, some from borrowed CDs and some purchased through iTunes, which have already been downloaded via iCloud (whichI assume were the purchased through iTunes). No Pirated music.

So, are you saying home sharing is not an alternative? I can't remember what I used to get the music on the MacBook. Before I got my iPad, I had my music on a G3 (upgraded to a G4 processor) B/W PPC desktop and I synced it to 80GB Color Display iPod. It has been so long ago, I think I might have used Home sharing because when I enabled home sharing on the MacBook and a Apple TV (second generation, music, with no playlists, appeared on the MacBook and photos appeared on the Apple TV (other than enabling Home Sharing , I can't even remember hitting any start button, everything just appeared). I know some songs did not transfer over. I went back to the G3 and copied the missing songs onto a flash drive and manually loaded them in iTunes on to the MacBook.

I am not familiar with the ApplicationMigration Wizard. Is it a purchased Application or shareware and is it real easy to use?


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 04, 2017 9:58 pm 
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Home Sharing is for playing music on another computer, not syncing that music with an iPad connected to your computer while the music is on another computer. You can similarly play music on iOS devices through Home Sharing but the current implementation of Home Sharing does not involve copying those files locally. The original version of home sharing was basically a file share, iTunes would start copying it to a temporary folder on your system, then start playing before the copy finished. As a result it was possible, with third party software, to basically just make a copy of all the music on the share. I don't know if you used that software to copy the stuff from system to system but if you did, it would be a much more cumbersome method of moving it than simply creating a file share and copying the files from system to system.

You can simply copy the files from computer to computer and open them on the new computer. That will work. For any purchased tracks that have drm in place (e.g. music tracks in m4p format) you will have to authorize the new system to your Apple ID. You have a limited number of computers that can be authorized at any one time, however you can deauthorize computers at any time, even deauthorize all computers that were ever connected to your account (though, last time I did it, it was only once a year).

If you want to then sync your iPad to the new computer it should warn you that it will have to setup your iPad as a new device and, if you continue, it will essentially wipe it out and start over from scratch as a new iOS device attached to your account. Nothing will be on your iOS device at that point. I honestly haven't done this in a while but once you start syncing a device with a computer this is how its supposed to work due to RIAA/MPAA contractual limitations. If you had never synced it with a computer then it would marry itself to the first computer you attach it to but not wipe the device.

The migration wizard is essentially run the first time you get a computer. It allows you to transfer applications, users, and data over from your old computer. If not used carefully it could end up wiping out applications, users, and data on your new computer, which is why you normally only run it during first time setup (although you can run it later - sometimes the only way to get it to complete a migration successfully is to do it after skipping it during initial setup). It is not something to be done casually, and certainly not without a very good backup (or couple of backups - e.g. Time Machine and a bootable backup that you've verified is actually bootable) of the new computer in case you need to revert to its old state.


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 04, 2017 10:07 pm 
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I should probably say what I would personally do. I would personally just copy all the iTunes library and data from that library on computer A that's synced to iOS device A over to computer B, verify it's present in computer B and iTunes can read the source files, the playlists all work, etc. then go ahead and wipe iOS device A by connecting it to computer B and syncing it all back onto the iOS device. So long as you have all the source files in iTunes, which I do, then you can easily restore them back onto the device by essentially recreating the iOS device settings in iTunes.

If you don't want to wipe out the iOS device, the only way I know to do it is by migrating your account using the migration wizard.


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 06, 2017 4:07 pm 
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MB,

Being a novice, I often need to have things clarified, sometimes to the extreme (ask BD Aqua) I was sort of confused by some of the acronyms you used and how it related to my issue. I reviewed some of what Migration Assistant docs and even went to You Tube to see their examples of MA in action. I even discovered a few other possible options. I am only interested in transferring iTunes and the playlists from my MacBook because iTunes is where I manage the music for my iPad, iPod and Apple TV. I call it syncing, if I made changes, ie. adds, deletes, renames, etc. when the iPad is plugged into the MacBook, the changes would be made But, you might call it something completely different. If the latter is true and I am using the incorrect terminology, I apologize for my error. After reviewing docs and viewing You Tube. I am beginning to think that if I used MA, the iMac would be an identical clone to the MacBook (App wise +other various items), Since I am sharing the iMac with my wife, the settings I need have already be set up on the iMac. I do not need that. MA will do far more than What I was looking for and maybe change things that I have already set up on the iMac. If you know of another option that would provide me with what I am looking for, I am open to any recommendation you might have.


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 06, 2017 8:16 pm 
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Apple's 6 pages of exhaustively meticulous step-by-step instructions: How to move your iTunes library to a new computer - https://support.apple.com/HT204318 Use this if you suspect any of your media are not in the standard location (iTunes Media folder).

My one-sentence summary if you always use iTunes' default preferences settings: Copy the entire iTunes folder (and in doing so all its sub-folders and files) intact to the other drive, hold down the option/alt key (shift on Windows) while starting iTunes, and when requested to select a library select the iTunes Library.itl file in the copied folder (Open a different iTunes Library file or create a new one - https://support.apple.com/HT201596).

Your device is looking for a specific .itl library file when syncing. If you use your device with a different one the device will want to erase first. Home Sharing copies media files from one computer to another but does not copy the .itl library file and so will result in a different library which will not sync without erasing first.


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 06, 2017 10:15 pm 
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Limnos

Thanks I Value your input. I will look at your recommendations and will study the HT docs. I appreciate you taking the time to participate in this discussion

Thanks again,
Blazer88


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PostPosted: Sat Jan 07, 2017 8:32 pm 
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Running iTunes even once on a computer will create a library file in the iTunes folder. When you connect your device to any computer with iTunes the device syncs to that particular computer's library. If you connect it to a different computer with a different library file the device will detect this and will want to erase the device so you can sync it with the second computer's iTunes library file. The only way to prevent this is to copy the iTunes library (= entire iTunes folder) from the first computer to the second one so when it is attached there it will see the same library file and sync with it. You cannot transfer this file (iTunes Library.itl) alone because it does not have all the settings for the other files and folders in the iTunes folder which make up the rest of a library.

If you have not attached your device to a computer before then there is no way to prevent it from being erased. Despite advances in iCloud you really still need a computer as the primary storage and control platform for a media collection.

If you already have a library on the second computer then things get messy. There is no easy way to merge two libraries. Your only real option (unless I spend the next hour typing in detailed instructions which still won't produce an easy merge) is to copy the media files that do not exist on the first library and add them to the second library as new files.


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PostPosted: Sun Jan 08, 2017 12:54 pm 
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Limnos,
Re: third paragraph "If you already have a library on the second computer then things get messy": When I went through the iMac set up and set up iCloud, iCloud automatically deposited purchased iTunes music onto iTunes. (So, iTunes shows music content on the iMac) When I am ready to transfer the iTunes back up to the iMac (which will already have the music selections purchased from iTunes from iCloud). Does this classify as messy? should I delete the music selections in the iMac first first before transferring the back up to avoid duplicates?


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 09, 2017 11:24 am 
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Yes, that's messy. There isn't really any way to "sync" two iTunes libraries. If you are positive all the contents of one is already replicated in the second then you can go ahead and just completely replace the other library folder. If you are not sure, that's when you add all the media from one library to the other and spend a weekend sorting duplicates.


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 09, 2017 12:03 pm 
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Limnos,
If by unfortunate circumstances I have to sort through duplicates, the music selections that were loaded via the iCloud indicates that iTunes is retrieving the music selection from iCloud for playback (iCloud Symbol), where other music selections that do not have the iCloud symbol (I assume the playback is coming from the computer). Which do I keep?


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PostPosted: Sat Jan 14, 2017 8:09 am 
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Oct 2016 King_Penguin post on only showing music actualy present on a computer or device - https://discussions.apple.com/message/3 ... ge30776308


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PostPosted: Sat Jan 14, 2017 6:20 pm 
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Attachment:
iTunes Ex..tiff
iTunes Ex..tiff [ 41.36 KiB | Viewed 720 times ]
Limnos,

Not quite sure how Penguin's Post pertains to my issue or the question I posed to you. Am I to use Penguin's recommended resolution on the new iMac? What I was asking pertained to existing music in the iMac Library when I transferred my Backed up iTunes Library from the MacBook to the iTunes in my new iMac. I kind of got the feeling from you, when I transferred the back up data, it would add the new data to the existing data in the iMac, thus creating some duplicates. If I am correct in my assumption, I wanted to know which duplicate music entry to delete. Presently this is what the iMac 's iTunes shows:

Attachment:
iTunes Ex..tiff
iTunes Ex..tiff [ 41.36 KiB | Viewed 720 times ]


I have not added anything to the iTunes Library. These tracks are stored in the cloud and I am guessing that when I select a track to play, the track is coming from the cloud vs from the computer. So, my question is which track to delete,cloud track or computer track.

Note: if Penquin's resolution does pertain to me, I will wait for your recommendation, but I may have some questions relating to tab selections. I was unable to locate a tab recommended in the thread and for some reason, I can not bring up the thread to tell which tab it is..

UPDATE:

I am sorry this particular post is hosed up with the two images, but if you do not concern yourself with them. I will tell you what I found. I went back over the Penguin Thread and what I got from it was I was to go from iTunes>Preferences>View. Well I looked all over for view in iTunes Preferences and never found VIEW, hence my statement "did not know how it related to me". I was so concentrated on the instruction in the Thread, I did not notice the View tab adjacent to the iTunes FILE and EDIT options on the top bar. After selecting View, and selecting the appropriate option, I can see why you recommended it. It completely eliminated all the iCloud entries.Now, will those eliminated entries have any effect on the iTunes Library I transfer over from my back up?[color=#000000][/color]. By eliminating the files using Penguin's procedure, the files are still in the database but just hidden from view meaning they are still in the iTunes Library. What I am trying to ask is : inputting the backed up data into the iTunes file, does it wipe out the existing data in the file or just add to it?


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 17, 2017 7:28 pm 
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Realize I am dealing with this all in the extreme abstract. I run iTunes 7.5 and have no iTunes store account, nor make any use of iCloud or any of its services so I just know what I have read others post which is why most of my responses are links to other documents -- you can read them and assess them. ;) My understanding is that if you see something in iTunes and it says it is on your computer it is on your computer. I don't know if there is a way to deal with items having copies on the computer and in iCloud.

iTunes works through a database file (iTunes Library.itl). In the simplest operation iTunes does not inventory files on your computer, it relies on the database being correct. If you have a track on your computer and add it to iTunes, iTunes makes a note of the data for the file, then puts it in the media folder and notes its location. If you put a second copy of that file on your computer and add it iTunes does the same again. iTunes does not see them as duplicates because it just sees them as files and the fact the two files are identical makes no difference to it. iTunes has worked this way since before iTunes was called iTunes.

Now iCloud adds another level of complexity and this is also where my experience with it is purely academic. You also have two computers each with their own library which you are trying to merge which is making things even more complicated. My understanding is when you turn on an iCloud service such as Apple Music or Match iTunes starts comparing what you have on the computer with what is in Apple's own collection. If it sees something it thinks is a match for their collection iCloud makes a note of that and if you want to download a copy onto another device it will take iCloud's copy. If Apple does not have a copy they will make a copy of your copy and put it in iCloud but leave the original on your computer. So if you have a phone and look at your library in iCloud what you are seeing is files stored in iCloud that are either Apple's or copies of your originals. I could see, therefore, that if you have iCloud library turned on and you have items on your computer that you might start seeing duplicates, one in iCloud and one on your computer. Okay, my understanding is if you delete the copy on your computer that the iCloud one will remain and stream should you want to play it. I am not so clear on what happens if you delete the one in iCloud, if that is even possible since in theory it should be mirroring everything on the computer.

Personally I would make sure you never rely upon iCloud to act as a backup for your media. Always have a copy on a spare drive.

About iTunes library files - https://support.apple.com/HT201610 - Does not mention that a complete working library also includes other files and folders also in the iTunes folder.

More on iTunes library files and what they do - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ITunes#Media_management

What are all those iTunes files? - http://www.macworld.com/article/139974/ ... files.html

Where are my iTunes files located? - http://support.apple.com/kb/ht1391

iTunes 9 [and later]: Understanding iTunes Media Organization - http://support.apple.com/HT201979 - plus supplemental information about organizing to new structure https://discussions.apple.com/message/26404702#26404702

Image of folder structure and explanation of different iTunes versions (turingtest2 post) - https://discussions.apple.com/docs/DOC-7392 and making an iTunes library portable.


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 18, 2017 1:53 pm 
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Limnos,

Thank you, I respect you for being so honest. Even though you have not experienced the issues that are confusing me at this time, you do know how to retrieve the pertinent information that may assist me in making a logical conclusion. I do apologize for having sent you an email for you to respond to my UPDATE, but I just did know if you would receive notification that I had added to new information in my last post.

Again, thank you for responding.

Blazer88


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 18, 2017 2:40 pm 
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Sorry for leaving you hanging, I'm just crazy busy at work lately and only check in here when I have free time. I saw Limnos stepped up with information and didn't see anything wrong so I stayed silent. When I stay silent I can fire up my PC earlier and play games a little longer before going to bed, so its win-win for me. :lol:


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PostPosted: Sat Jan 28, 2017 1:23 pm 
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MB,

I decided to follow Limnos' recommended procedure to transfer iTunes from my McBook 2,1 to my new iMac to manage my music collection for my iPad and iPod otherwise , yes I would have been hanging if Limnos had not stepped in. Have fun playing your games!


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